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OP-8656Status unassessedLogic and foundations

Games · Question 1

From ℵ2 to infinity · Historical workshop question

Editorial mapping of AIMPL source category: Logic. http://aimpl.org/alephtwo/ Not an author-supplied MSC code.

Historical list · status unassessedAs of 2026-09-08Source & evidence ↓

Problem statement

  • For what values of κ\kappa and γ\gamma are these games determined?

  • How can these games be generalized to, for example, extender sequences? What about strong compactness and supercompactness?

Lean 4

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Background

Question context

Let κ\kappa be a regular cardinal and γ\gamma an infinite ordinal. Consider the following two-player game (called the Welch game): Player II plays κ\kappa-algebras Ai\mathscr{A}_i, while Player II plays increasing κ\kappa-complete filters Fi\mathcal{F}_i on Ai\mathscr{A}_i. The game goes on for γ\gamma many steps. The first player to break one of the rules loses.

Progress & source assessment

Historical workshop record. Current open/solved status has not been independently reassessed.

Status note in the source

Known facts:

  • (Keisler-Tarksi) If γ=ω\gamma=\omega, then II has a winning strategy.

  • (Foreman-Magidor-Shelah) If II has a winning strategy when γ=ω+1\gamma=\omega+1, then there is a precipitous ideal on κ\kappa.

  • Suppose GCH holds and ω1<cf(γ)=γ<κ+\omega_1<\text{cf}(\gamma)=\gamma<\kappa^+. If II has a winning strategy, then there exists a κ\kappa-complete ideal on κ\kappa which has a dense tree TT of height γ\gamma which is closed under descending sequences of length <γ<\gamma.

  • If κ\kappa is measurable, then II has a winning strategy in the game of length 2κ2^\kappa.

References
  1. [1]From ℵ2 to infinity link

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